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A-train-DB

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Thu Apr 25, 2013 5:43 pm

I was just saying. Just saying....
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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Thu Apr 25, 2013 5:58 pm

U guys wanna see my dick?
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$ MalinOMW

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:36 pm

KingDouble-DB wrote:
U guys wanna see my dick?

finally!!!
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Lord chris

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:43 pm

Hell no

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:36 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Thu Apr 25, 2013 8:23 pm

player1 wrote:
Old school or new school. That's just an attempt to stereotype things. Everyone must've played cd/dc at one point and most will keep playing it, it's not necessarily old school. There are old players who only play 3rd party maps, there are people you believe to be "new school" that were playing cd/dc a decade ago.
This is correct. See how you stayed on topic and then provided evidence to support your assertion? That's what you need to do for the rest of this stuff instead of flaming about off-topic penis size.



Quote :
Well I won't elaborate anymore on grouped/spread specificly what's supposed to be the thread, I'll just reply to ck posts later, just to make it even more obvious that the level in any map (spread/grouped/whatever) is higher today than anytime before.
Please do. I've asked you to do this in other threads and you never have. You just say you have evolved this game to a point of nirvana but never provide a single piece of supporting evidence to the statment.

Quote :
I just am able to back up what I say
You haven't backed up a single thing you've said. Just give some examples and specifics. Saying you're amazing and everyone else is trash is not backing anything up. It is flaming. I know English is not your first language, but the basic principles of debating are not language specific.

My post had nothing to do with players being better or worse today than they were 10 years ago. It simply had to do with game design, which remains 100% unchanged since cavedog went out of business ~in 2000, and how said game design is affected by grouped 3rd party and spread cd/dc maps.

I made no assertions about spread being "better" I said it is preference. If you wish to "back up" what you say-- then provide some specific evidence to rebut the things I stated since you said they are factually incorrect. As a reminder I stated:

1) mon fights are not more frequent on grouped mana
2) grouped mana does not have more strategy and or unit composition/variability
3) grouped mana games more not quicker by design
4) drops are not more effective on grouped
5) spread is not all instinct but involves strategy as well
6) grouped communication is easier (agreement with other posters here)
7) you can also play treb wars on spread,
Cool zhon is mostly inferior on spread 1v1
10) base swaps are frequent in spread and infrequent in grouped.


Ok, those are the 10 things I talked about. Please state which # is wrong, how its wrong, and then provide evidence of why it is wrong.

Example: #4: Drops are more effective on grouped mana because the buildings and mana are forced to be bunched. This means you can take out entire mana with 1 drop. You can take out all buildings with 1 drop. etc.

There, I gave you explicit directions on how to properly engage in a debate on a said topic. Follow them and you can make me look like an idiot. Continue to flame and you just look like a butthurt douchebag.
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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:45 am

Quote :
Quote :
Well I won't elaborate anymore on grouped/spread specificly what's supposed to be the thread, I'll just reply to ck posts later, just to make it even more obvious that the level in any map (spread/grouped/whatever) is higher today than anytime before.
Please do. I've asked you to do this in other threads and you never have. You just say you have evolved this game to a point of nirvana but never provide a single piece of supporting evidence to the statment.
Seriously I've participated in so much threads about TAK gameplay and you definitely isn't the first I discuss with. I'll be frank now, you're not bad I'll give you that, but you could never play this game as well as many others could, so you can say you were good back then compared to them folks, but compared to today you're not good. I'm not rly a big fan of Double but if you came here some years he was "bragging" about how the highest level played so far was in WZ. I won't agree or disagree, but the only time he changed his opinion was when he couldn't catch up to the top guys there. THen I came back to TAK and, \"****\", things got even worse. Another example is Kaiser, he came here we had the same debate, he got owned because he never rly had game to support what he said. Anyways, I could give countless examples of stuff like that and how this isn't new.

And this game hasn't evolved to a point of nirvana but it has evolved compared to anytime before. And it can always get better.

Quote :
Quote :
I just am able to back up what I say
You haven't backed up a single thing you've said. Just give some examples and specifics. Saying you're amazing and everyone else is trash is not backing anything up. It is flaming. I know English is not your first language, but the basic principles of debating are not language specific.

My post had nothing to do with players being better or worse today than they were 10 years ago.
That's exactly what you did. You said spread today is played on a lower level than back then, based on posts of Arthan and Joker. I'm just saying that's wrong, not that everyone else is trash. But you're so low in the skill hierarchy in TAK so I had to "just say" too.

Quote :
There, I gave you explicit directions on how to properly engage in a debate on a said topic. Follow them and you can make me look like an idiot. Continue to flame and you just look like a butthurt douchebag.
I'll answer to it all and it's gonna be all at once. If you want me to do it sooner then maybe people just stop cheering my nickname 10 times. And you're a butthurt douchebag too.


I had finished this post but thought I'd answer to this first, I'll still answer to your older posts later.
Quote :
1) mon fights are not more frequent on grouped mana
2) grouped mana does not have more strategy and or unit composition/variability
3) grouped mana games more not quicker by design
4) drops are not more effective on grouped
5) spread is not all instinct but involves strategy as well
6) grouped communication is easier (agreement with other posters here)
7) you can also play treb wars on spread,
Cool zhon is mostly inferior on spread 1v1
10) base swaps are frequent in spread and infrequent in grouped.
1)depends on the map and players
2)i don't know what "more strategy" means in tak. but the more defensive the game gets the more unit variability you see, that's probably true
3) rephrase please
4) they probably are because many times you can't attack by foot, but rly depends on context/map
5) all maps are strategy/instinct/everything. you're probably talking about what joker said and he would probably beat u with his instinct alone lol
6) communication, team games. i know lots of "spread" maps that communication is rather simple too. again, contextual
7) no shit
8 ) mostly... depend on the maps people play mostly. i've beaten one guys aramon with my zhon in a minuscule cd/dc land map, hes in this topic and loves to brag about being cd/dc certified lol
10) first define base because if the manas are too spread then theres no particular base. in the other hand maps where all the manas are in a single place then base swap can be quite obvious and might happen. i used to do it a lot in 1v1, since rush waving the mana might be effective
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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:07 pm

WhY don't you two ladies just nut up, play five games, and post the results?
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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:11 pm


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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:12 pm

he could pick all maps and give them a plan/BO (lol) for a week and it would still be 5x0.

but i don't think it proves anything. i'd though start respecting him as a player because if you dont play you dont even count in this first place. the ultimate skill is playing, not winning

lmfaooo you're beautiful sammael Very Happy keep moving on pal
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$ MalinOMW

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:17 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:22 pm

KingDouble-DB wrote:
WhY don't you two ladies just nut up, play five games, and post the results?

playing him in a game has nothing to do with spread vs grouped mana. i'm not here saying he's a better or worse player than me. Certainly he should be better. I just said some people here must be terrible at cd/dc based on their posts. I said so without names--- but obviously i was referring to arthan and landherr already said I should ignore what he says.

Congrats to landherr though, he 70% of the way argued on topic with as small of an amount of flaming i've seen from any of his posts. Specific evidence to back up opinions weren't really there, but at least you had opinions on the topic itself. good job.
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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:31 pm

Arthan says stuff that makes sense, some others not. Just like you pal.

Well there's a lot to comment, flames, wrong stuff said. Concerning what I said, they should be absolute because I'm saying it (rofl jk), but if you rly want me to contribute more to "spread"x"grouped" then first we should define spread and grouped.

Ok let's consider all cd/dc maps are spread (except a few with 0 mana lol). Now whats grouped? bloods hunters has 8 groups of 6 mana spread symmetrically in every extreme of the map. Manas aren't rly separated, there are no standing stones around them. What's that, semi-grouped? spread grouped?

So of course if you compare a single tiled slim map, of a few manas in each start, with every "spread" mana map that possibly exists, then yea there will be "spread" mana maps requiring more in some areas of play and "grouped" would require less in some areas. Talking in a basic point of view, spread requires more expansion/multi. Grouped requires more mana management/micro. Both need macro and skills at the same scale. But that's stupid, u need multi/mana/micro/macro/skills in any map. Although skill/micro is the main thing, when macro/multi/mana should be fundamental. Even expansion, you need to expand wisely. Today someone who builds well in a "grouped" mana map will swallow u with tens and tens of builders mana income and u need space for that, that's some sort of building placement, expansion. moving units well just like in "spread".

Can't rly start a discussion without this defined. Then you gotta remember some maps with a group of mana at start also have some manas on middle or anywhere else symmetrically along the map, thats some sort of spread mana (most of them dont have standing stones like cd/dc maps tho).

Anyways I think spread is played generally in a higher level today, because even average/decent players, who played mostly 3rd party maps, would still win against older standards in "spread".

There's so much to say and that's exactly what I was avoiding, in the end it becomes a one-sided lecture and people calling me asshole/arrogant lol. No point.

Carnageking wrote:
I just said some people here must be terrible at cd/dc based on their posts.
LOL, you also said "or that the level of people that play spread at a high level went way down". What's pretty much the kind of stuff that started the flames. I wouldn't even mind, if that wasn't untrue.

And I could say you are terrible in cd/dc based on yours posts too. Unnecessary, but I know people love flames so it's okay.
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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Fri Apr 26, 2013 10:43 pm

Listen you guys who cares aslong as you have fun on the map no one gives a shit about whats more stratigic or witch ones more defencive all the maps CD/DC and 3rd party both come with there streghts and weaknesses play the maps you like or both but dont sit here and whin witch ones are betters because they both bring there own flavor of spice to the game

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PostSubject: Re: Why...   Sat Apr 27, 2013 8:38 am

The comparison is wider than original map or 3rd party map. And I thought "defense" was also strategy?
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