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Nailo

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PostSubject: Ethics in TA:K   Sun Dec 30, 2012 3:29 pm

I recently saw an argument among among some TA:K players on the forums and I thought it might be a good idea to have a post for those who are new to the multi-player scene in TA:K on good ethics/ manners. I myself am rather new to the scene as well so I don't know everything.

Obviously cussing and insulting the other person is bad ethics and bad manners. If one of the more knowledgeable TA:K pros out there could possibly type up a list of what is or might be considered bad manners and post them for us newbs to see that would be much appreciated.

An example of what I'm referring to is that I heard that apparently their is something that might be consider bad mannered to have open gates?! Not sure why but I think it might have to do with the AI targeting or something. Could someone give us some help so we don't end up angering everyone in TA:K multi-player with simple ignorance.

Thanks again, Nailo

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$ MalinOMW

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:58 pm

1) open gates - never leave open gate cause unit aim to middle gate, and they never hit the gate, they mistake to middle, so open gate become almost invicible immortal whatever, and its make really annoy players cause u cant destroy it (it considered to be bug using bugs is not allowed usually in any games)

2) speed +10 - on multiplayer we play almost always with 0 normal speed, i know this game can look slow but trust me if u will know how to play u will have no time to make everything proper even with this normal speed (maybe begin can look really slow cause monarch build only barrack etc but later there are many stuff to do)

3) middle rule - if there are team game (2v2 3v3 4v4) and teams didnt appear top vs bottom or right vs left etc (there are 2 players from X team and 1 player from Y team in one side and on second side there are 1 player from X team and 2 players from Y team). SO if that happens, players dont have proper start location, everybody go to middle and then players go to left/right or top/bottom map (usually if something is wrong with begin map everybody yells "MIDDLE MIDDLE , STOP BUILDING GO MIDDLE" etc and just listen people and go to middle then, listen where on which side your team go and go with team)

4) trebuchet rule - if you aramon, listen before game, if people say that trebuchet is NOT allowed dont build trebuchet during game, or some people can get annoy (trebuchet is many time forbidden cause of his super range x2 mortar x3 fire demon range)

5) before playing with people play some games with AI to get basics of the basics (its my opinion)



sorry for my english but i dont have better xD
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:50 pm

MalinOMW wrote:
sorry for my english but i dont have better xD

haha sadly everything you say is starting to make sense to me
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Mon Dec 31, 2012 12:12 pm

I remember the 1st time I left my gate open in multiplayer. I got screamed at in Portuguese and I had no idea what was wrong. Luckily Henri was there to clarify what i had did wrong. BTW what happened to KM-Sage???? He just abandon his forums?

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Mon Dec 31, 2012 2:17 pm

gate -> portuguese -> km-sage

How the hell did you get there lol
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:51 pm

Thanks MalinOMW for helping out, and don't worry, your English is very good. I'll readily admit I had no clue about the speed or middle rule. I figured all the TA:K pros played high speed, but now that I know its not so, I'm a bit more relieved. I'd also like to ask are there any other bugs we newbs should know about? I don't know about you guys but I don't enjoy getting yelled at in Portuguese. Laughing I did read somewhere on this forum about a, don't quote me on this, off map glitch? Question I think I understand what its talking about because I've had my Tarsonian rug guys ( I forgot their name lol ) just fly off the map at random when building me a divine lodestone Sad

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:57 pm

I think differently, I dont care about being textually yelled at in languages I dont understand. It is kind of funny actually JAPIERDOLE KURWA lol
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Mon Dec 31, 2012 5:24 pm

Nailo, the offscreen glitch consists in making your flying unit go "Off the Screen" or "Off the Map". So, the enemy can't see it, and when he sees, a Roc is dropping 5 acolytes in your base, and he thinks "WTF HOW DID IT APPEAR IN MY BASE?". Well, OffScreen just can be done at the Top of the screen (hmm bottom/right/left is much harder, I guess only Gryphon can access it (while attacking a unit))...

Here is a screenshot of a unit offscreen:
Spoiler:
 

Just keep clicking at the top of the map and your unit is offscreen (if you unselect it, you can't select it again while it is offscreen lol!).

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Lord ZacDom

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Mon Dec 31, 2012 6:02 pm

Best Ever wrote:
gate -> portuguese -> km-sage

How the hell did you get there lol



I was just thinking Very Happy I have only played against him once... and that was 2 years ago!!!! and the portuguese was because of the open gate glitch that I unknowingly did. xD I have crazy thought processes.
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:17 am

Thanks for explaining it too me DK-Manolo. Also appreciate the screenshot. Can the ai of other units still shoot the glitched unit or can they not do anything about it till it comes back on to the screen? Can I assume this is also a well disliked glitch? Because I would think Thirsa would enjoy this glitch greatly if the ai of archers and towers couldn't target off screen units.

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$_ARTHAN

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:31 am

I have made multiplayer maps where trebs or gates or off-screen aren't allowed. I can make even more of them if you wish.
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 12:03 pm

Nailo wrote:
1-Can the ai of other units still shoot the glitched unit or can they not do anything about it till it comes back on to the screen? 2-Can I assume this is also a well disliked glitch? Because I would think Thirsa would enjoy this glitch greatly if the ai of archers and towers couldn't target off screen units.

1- Well, in the offscreen glitch, you can't send your unit so far off the map. You can just send it to the top of the map and it will stay near the limit of the map (never so far). Your units can't target it automatically like, when patrolling. Sometimes the unit offscreen doesn't appear in the map, but in the mini-map (radar). So, you need target it, selecting your units and clicking to attack the unit offscreen in the radar, sometimes the TAB key is useful. You can also identify an unit offscreen with its shadow.

2- Yeah, this glitch is very "bad", if the enemy sees your roc going offscreen, he will ask to you to give the roc to him, or to you delete it (I guess Thirsha wouldn't like to be deleted lol!).

That's it! =)

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:02 pm

but offscreen can be consider as a trick but really b i t c h y trick, i think on cd/dc maps this trick dont give much advantage as on 3rd maps

cd/dc maps- old normall maps created by cavedog (or even people its not important Very Happy ) that got spread mana on whole map there are usually(expection Angivr maze) every type of mana "circle" small (+5 mana) medium (+10 mana) big (+20 mana) (divine lodestone give x2 mana) this type of map got usually many type texture, trees (i hate them) and sometimes isnt enough symetric/ballance

3rd maps- new maps with grouped mana usually its base vs base map there are usually only big circle mana (+20) (there are no any map made by cavedog only by fans)

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:12 pm

Alright so lets see:

1. Never open your gates
2. Keep the speed at Normal
3. Call for everyone to go to middle in case of incorrect team placement
4. Make sure as Aramon you understand how everyone feels about trebuchets
5. Practice with Ai
6. Avoid sending units off-screen

Is that about everything that can tick players off? or are there some more?
No worries Arthan, I enjoy the maps we have already, if you want to make more than by all means go ahead Smile

Also, are most tourny's balanced by grouped mana? How can a map be balanced for the 5 races?

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:16 pm

You can open gates, just don't keep them open it's gay Razz

*4. Don't worry about trebs, make them whenever you want, unless the game is no trebs so don't be a \"*****\" and build them lol

5 is waste of time imo
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:45 pm

lol Best Ever, thanks for the corrections.

I feel trebs are fine too but they really can be annoying in the most annoying way possible.

AI might not prepare one for a multiplayer match, but its fun sometimes and I feel thats the point of the game (to have fun that is) Smile

Any ideas on map balance Best Ever?

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:55 pm

ya 5 is waste of time unless u hadn't play any game
its just good to figure and discover basics of the basics*

*-how get mana
-feel the desing and interface
-how transport build atack repair etc units
-learn some units (not all, with AI its imposible to discover all units advantages and disadvanteages of the units, and many of advantages against real player seems useless)
-also remember don't play too much against AI cause u gonna copy that crapy tactics from AI like making tons of towers and slow expand


Quote :
How can a map be balanced for the 5 races?

i think its something like Perpetual motion no one knows if it can exists Very Happy


Quote :
Also, are most tourny's balanced by grouped mana?

no one also knows if grouped mana make map more ballance Very Happy
also i dont know why they are now(since i play multiplayer after 2008-9) so popular, its like fashion/trend everybody buy but don't know why this Very Happy


About ballancing
if map gonna be small zhon and creon got hard (less than 2-5x4-6 or something)
if map have many manas is small and need fast expand zhon also got hard, creon get little harder (ex. 3rd map blood hunters,cd/dc ?sewers of elam?)
if map have many walls, mountains, path got weird look, or even (this seems rly unballance-> ) there are no way to get somewhere without flying units (some 3rd maps and little cd/dc angvir maze) zhon and taros got easier cause to thirsha/ghost ship
if map is something big (depends on type of map but its something more than ?15x15?) not much mana zhon/taros seems more power cause of drops

so typicall map got something (IT DEPENDS but smaller or bigger maps seems weird/unplayable/not fashion Very Happy) size like (2-15)x(6-15) or (6-15)x(2-15)



(my opinion below) and the next one worth to remind if someone make maps
more manas (specially typical grouped) the longer game will take cause both sides make many units and its hard to destroy that enemy lots of sh-its (everybody spam and spam range units and its hard to make good some special strategy which change the chance to win like drop, use fire mage, wave with monarch (example its harder to drop with 10 rocs against 20 stronghold than with 2 roc against 4 strongholds, etc)

less manas can annoy people cause they need to wait for everything and monarch seems strong for little longer time, but u need economically think and every units seems more worth (better micro require)
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:25 am

Nailo, Do you play on Game Ranger??? I would like to play a match or 2 with you if you are interested in a challenge! >Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Wed Jan 02, 2013 5:16 am

Thanks again MalinOMW for helping me to understand maps a little bit better and to Lord ZacDom, I do indeed play on gameranger and I'll gladly play against you as many times as you wish Smile we are in the same time zone so just give me some general times when your on gameranger or if you prefer I could pick the time, The best time for me generally is from 3pm to 6pm weekday or weekends.

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:55 pm

Cool Very Happy. What is your GR ID and nick so i can add you to my friends?? Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Wed Jan 02, 2013 5:42 pm

Why its Nailo of course. That is both my Game Ranger ID and my Nickname.
And what would yours be Lord Zacdom?

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:40 pm

Nailo wrote:
lol Best Ever, thanks for the corrections.

I feel trebs are fine too but they really can be annoying in the most annoying way possible.

AI might not prepare one for a multiplayer match, but its fun sometimes and I feel thats the point of the game (to have fun that is) Smile

Any ideas on map balance Best Ever?

Trebs are particularly annoying when they beat you Smile

Well, for me AI stopped being fun once I found out about multiplayer.

For last, all maps are balanced since all players can do the same things, they can pick the same 4 (or 5) races, etc. It's impossible to get more balanced than that ;P
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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:47 pm

Trebs suck...... I only use them if someone else (using Veruna,Creon,Aramon) use trebs/prizmatics/mortars. Then I get pissed and treb them to death Very Happy



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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:39 pm

lol Glad to see everyone has a sense of humor. I'll admit the ai definitley can't compare to a human opponent, I just use the ai's for when I just want to mess around Smile sometimes I just watch the ais fight each other for my enjoyment lol

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PostSubject: Re: Ethics in TA:K   Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:48 pm

Nailo wrote:
sometimes I just watch the ais fight each other for my enjoyment lol

one time i create even some maps and watch who gonna win,
but AI make too many defense structure so they got big difficult to win



but omg wow with rammstein mod i can make game and watch and do something else (game not pause during doing something other) buehehe lest watch 1v1 aramon taros (aramon should win cause of better defend system and trebuchets, but if aramon gonna build at begin 3 watch towers and taros gonna try something like fast expand with army it can be nice Very Happy)

so lets spectate (3rd map with 6 mana LOL)
Edit 1 ,2 ,3

Aramon lodestone > watch tower>watch tower (just many mana left Very Happy) >lodestone>omg watch tower again

Taros Abbyss (omfg he gonna be slow but better than temple)

Edit 4

Aramon made 2 lodestone in the row>barrack>watch tower>strongold Sad
Taros 3 lodestone>caged demon Sad

that after 6 minutes they got nothing Sad
Edit 5
I am pretty sure that demo AI(with only demo units) should win vs full version AI on small medium maps Very Happy
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